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2011 Honda CR-Z vs. 1987 Honda CRX Si

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    2011 Honda CR-Z vs. 1987 Honda Civic CRX Si Picture

    CRX Si vs. CR-Z: two cars, one tradition. | July 02, 2010

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2011 Honda CR-Z vs. 1987 Honda CRX Si

One Heritage, Two Cars

    31 Ratings

    Honda has pretty much dared everyone to do this comparison. If it had called its new hybrid two-seater the Insight Coupe or the H2S or the EI-EI-O, then maybe those of the thick-headed persuasion would never thought of comparing the 2011 Honda CR-Z with a 1987 Honda CRX Si.

    But no, Honda went and called its new car "CR-Z" (it stands for "Compact Renaissance Zero," the corporate product planners tell us), so we're all comparing it to the CRX in our minds if not in sheet metal. So Honda, don't whine. You asked for it.

    If the CR-Z comes up short, don't blame us. Instead blame all those engineers working at Honda back in the early 1980s, some of them now up in senior management, many of them retired and a few dead. They're the ones who did such a spectacular job with the original Civic CRX. Because it is a car with a magical luster that hasn't faded with time.

    Back to Simple
    In 1976 Honda adopted one of the greatest ad slogans ever chiseled out of an agency flack's brain: "We Make It Simple." These four words perfectly summarized the guiding principles of Honda's design philosophy back when the Honda Accord was brand-new and the company still had to prove itself in the American market. This was back when people bought Hondas because they were, in fact, simple and exquisitely engineered. And even though Honda stopped using "We Make It Simple" as a slogan way back in 1982, a lot of people still believe that's what Honda is all about. Or, at least, is supposed to be all about.

    The Honda Civic was due for a generational change with the 1984 model year, but the CRX was an unexpected addition to the line. "Honda's all-new Civic CRX 1.5 suggests the term 'Rollerskate GT' because," wrote Kevin Smith for Motor Trend upon first encountering it, "walking up to it for the first time you may think it's easier to strap it to your feet than to climb into; it truly looks like a toy."

    Almost 27 years later, we approach Chris Hoffman's well-preserved and well-used 1987 CRX Si and it still seems inconceivably small. At just 144.7 inches long, this first-generation Honda CRX is 0.9 inch shorter overall than a 2010 Mini Cooper, while its 86.8-inch wheelbase is an amazing 10.3 inches shorter than the BMW-engineered Mini. More pertinently, the CRX is a staggering 15.9 inches shorter overall than the new CR-Z, while its wheelbase is 9.1 inches shorter.

    The Style of No Style
    But it's not just the Honda CRX's super-dink proportions that differentiate it from its hybrid grandkid. The CRX's body is almost unadorned; the flat body panels are clean and free of styling flourishes. This unfussiness lets the CRX's slope-backed profile become the visual focal point of the car. The CR-Z's visual firepower, on the other hand, lies in details like the character lines that run along its flanks, around the beautifully shaped rear taillights and across the rear glass panel.

    There's a real cigarette lighter next to a real ashtray for those precious moments with a menthol 100.

    Where the CR-Z fails stylewise, is in its flat and busy nose. It's too flat (thanks for the pedestrian impact standards, EU!) and over-decorated with a massive grille. The big, heavily sculpted holes beneath the headlights contain driving lights that look as if they were pulled from a parts bin as an afterthought. With the old CRX you have to work hard to even find the grille. And while the CRX's driving lights might as well be stuck on the front of the car with Elmer's Glue-All, they're as square as the headlights at least.

    Of course there are design elements to the CRX that are archaic. The 14-inch wheels with four round holes in them are pure retro from the Huey Lewis era, the mud flaps look like they're off a Kenworth big rig and the marker lights in the front fender are just arbitrary. But overall, the CRX is still a sweet little package. And it's still a great-looking car — timeless, really.

    The CR-Z isn't likely to age that well.

    Interior Simplicity
    Both the CRX and CR-Z do a great job of accommodating two people and more of their stuff than you might think possible. There are some style and convenience differences, however. And they matter.

    Of course the CRX was built back in those bloody, gore-splattered, awful days when airbags weren't a mandated element of every car. So when you face the steering wheel, the dashboard seems almost barren. Still, however, every control is at the driver's fingertips. There's a nice cubby with a hinged lid atop the dash in which to accumulate change for the tollway (back when tollways didn't require folding money), and there's a real cigarette lighter next to a real ashtray for those precious moments that can only be completed by firing up a Benson & Hedges Menthol 100.

    The CRX's harshly trapezoidal dash cover over the instrumentation looks dated; the orange-on-black numerals of the instrumentation was a bad idea back then and still is; the slider-based ventilation controls aren't as convenient as dials; and both the seats and door panels are covered in mouse fur. But these are just decorator issues. The driving position is low, but perfect. The seats are nicely shaped. And any single-DIN radio will slide right in.

    The CR-Z innards are, yes, better than the CRX's. The seats are better, there are more storage areas strewn around the cockpit and the navigation system is an improvement over any single-DIN radio. Yes, the instrumentation is a bit too Tokyo pop, but otherwise the CR-Z interior is a great driving environment.

    Nevertheless, once you throw some airbags into the CRX, round off the dash angles, redesign the instrumentation graphics, add power windows and mirrors and upholster everything in contemporary materials, this interior would be among the best offered in any small car today.

    Driving Simplicity
    According to Honda's factory specifications, the 1987 Honda CRX weighed 1,830 pounds with a full tank of fuel, which makes it 824 pounds lighter than the CR-Z EX. The math says this means every one of the CRX Si's 91 horses has to move 20.1 pounds of vehicle mass. Each of the CR-Z EX's 122 horses has to contend with 21.8 pounds of heft. Virtually all the measurable performance differences between the two cars can be explained in light of those numbers.

    In deference to Chris Hoffman's CRX Si's age and 108,500 miles, we're using performance numbers generated by Motor Trend in its issue of March 1985, which featured coverage of the 1985 Honda CRX Si. The CRX galloped to 60 mph in 8.1 seconds (with 1 foot of rollout like on a drag strip) and ripped through the quarter-mile in 16.2 seconds at 84.5 mph. That's not terrible performance today, and it was terrific performance for back then. Faster than the Mitsubishi Mirage Turbo, Pontiac Fiero V6 and Toyota MR2, the editors noted.

    These acceleration numbers, however, don't tell the whole performance story of the CRX Si. Its punk-spec, fuel-injected SOHC 12-valve 1.5-liter inline-4 might predate the introduction of VTEC variable valve timing, but it's still a rev-happy twerp. Throw in the precise shifting of the five-speed transmission and the result is still a blast to drive. It's not just good in a vintage way; it's good in every way.

    In contrast, the CR-Z is simply more of a chore to drive. First, the driver needs to pick a driving mode — Econ, Normal or Sport — and then it's a matter of tuning oneself to drive within that mode. A soft touch for the Econ, a moderate touch for Normal and moderately harder touch for Sport. The CR-Z demands more attention than the CRX.

    Like the original CRX Si, the CR-Z has a fuel-injected SOHC 1.5-liter inline-4, and thanks to 16 valves and i-VTEC it makes 113 horsepower on its own. Combine it with Honda's Integrated Motor Assist (IMA) hybrid system and the output goes up to 122 hp. And in Sport mode, there's actually some low-end torque to play with.

    At full throttle the CR-Z performs the same no matter what mode it's in. And that performance is a trip to 60 mph in 8.8 seconds (8.5 seconds with 1 foot of rollout) and 16.5 seconds at 84.1 mph for the quarter-mile. If you engage the traction and stability control system (technology the CRX Si conspicuously lacks), you get to 60 mph in 9.4 seconds (9.1 seconds with 1 foot of rollout) and reach the quarter-mile in 17.1 seconds at 82.9 mph.

    The CR-Z's six-speed shifts great and the entire hybrid drivetrain is refined, but it's not as quick as the old CRX Si. And yes, that's even after taking into account Motor Trend's aggressive weather corrections and timing methods in 1985.

    Simple Life, Simple Pleasures
    Set up right on aggressive tires, an old CRX is a monster in autocross events. But even wearing the modest 185/60R14s that Chris Hoffman's car does, the CRX Si is a precise driving instrument from the tip of its manual steering to the trailing edge of its rear beam axle.

    In comparison, the CR-Z really is one of the very best-driving hybrids to go on sale in America. But it can't duplicate the direct connection between car and driver that the CRX provides. The CR-Z does have a more compliant and controlled ride than the CRX, but it's nowhere near as much fun.

    But also keep this in mind. While we all remember the CRX for its extraordinary fuel mileage, this is because of the special, low-performance, fuel-sipping CRX HF. Back in 1987 the EPA rated the Honda CRX HF at an incredible 52 mpg in the city and 57 mpg on the highway. But once you calculate the CRX's numbers with the latest EPA methodology, its results drop to 42 mpg and 51 mpg, respectively. The 1987 CRX Si, on the other hand, carried a sticker showing an EPA-certified 30 mpg in the city and 33 mpg on the highway, which converts to 26 mpg in the city and 30 on the highway today. The legend of the hyper-parsimonious CRX is at least somewhat conditional.

    But the bigger, heavier 2011 Honda CR-Z six-speed carries an EPA rating of 31 mpg in the city and 37 on the highway. While other hybrids do better, the CR-Z actually does very well in the context of its ancestors.

    A Simple Summary
    As we've discovered here in this 1987 Honda CRX Si, the CRX Si in its first- and second-generation forms remains among the most lovable cars that Honda has ever produced. And if Honda produced something directly equivalent to them today — as lightweight and with just as delightful a powertrain — we'd all want one.

    But that's not what Honda offers us. Times have changed, and the 2011 Honda CR-Z shows us that modern standards of safety and comfort have taken their toll on the size and weight of small cars, even as improved structural rigidity and electronically enhanced engines, brakes and vehicle control systems have made them better for everyday transportation.

    Yet what Honda offers in the CR-Z isn't that bad at all.

    Sort By:

    dha says:

    05:08 AM, 08/07/2011

    I still have my 1987 Honda CRX Si more than 400k miles later.  I've replaced alternators, CV joints, struts (Tokico) and regular maintenance including Mobil 1 since mile 200.  It still runs like a champ, is fun to drive and now a-days turns heads too.  I get 34mpg driven aggressively and 36 if I attempt to follow the urging of the signs.  My friend once had the CRX HF and got 55-70mpg!  Show me a hybrid that delivers that at 60mph, or explain the rationale for hybids when a 30 year-old design out performs in every way.

    Compared to a modern car it is noisy and rides rough but it still corners like a champ, and if you are willing to shift it to keep it on the pipe, it will move. It makes my Maxima SE feel like a Caddy (big, loose and vague), and the shifter in the Maxima is no comparison either.  

    Still a classic.  I hope to get mine to a half million miles!  Honda should look at the S2000-CRX linage and give us another real car.  Take risks like Mazda and deliver us something fun.

    doke01 says:

    03:42 AM, 03/07/2011

    I owned a CRX Si and it was one of the best cars I owned.  I miss it even today.  It was so fun to drive and the mpg was amazing!  I remember driving from NY to Washington D.C and 3/4 of the way back on one tank of gas.  I got really excited when I saw the CR-Z.  It is unfortunate that it is not as fun to drive as the CRX was.  I was really interested in it.  I will probably take a test drive anyway but my hopes are not as high as they once were.

    timb6 says:

    10:18 AM, 02/05/2011

    I owned a CRX identical to the one in this article, and it never got close to the EPA rated MPG..

    It did even better! I averaged around 35 mpg and got 40 mpg on the highway.

    kjgood says:

    10:25 AM, 07/13/2010

    Didn't we see a prequel to this when Inside Line did the old-Integra R vs new-Civic SI comparo?  With similar results?  For similar reasons?
      
    "Times have changed, and the 2011 Honda CR-Z shows us that modern standards of safety and comfort have taken their toll on the size and weight of small cars, even as improved structural rigidity and electronically enhanced engines, brakes and vehicle control systems have made them better for everyday transportation."

    But the truth of the matter is that Honda didn't need to do an update of the old car with an overly-heavy and ugly hybrid, the design philosophy of which is in many ways inconsistent with that of the much superior (given the context of the times) CRX.  If Honda's gas engine development were not falling behind current technology, there would be no reason they couldn't have designed a lighter car (especially if it's only a two-seater) with a direct-injection gas engine of say, 1.8 liters, which would exceed the performance of both CRX & CRZ, while getting fuel mileage closer to the latter.  

    The further truth is that while "times have changed" the real difference is that Honda's focus is chiefly what has changed.  Honda has abandoned their sporting spirit and have latched resolutely onto "green" at the expense of enthusiast cars.  They apparently think that as an offering to those who still expect some degree of their old spirit from them, it is sufficient to produce what they consider to be a sexy hybrid.  Perhaps IL is a bit taken in, but the resulting CRZ is still a dud. Honda could, and should, do much better.  It remains to be seen if moribund sales will effectively deliver that message to them.  I wouldn't buy a CRZ over a Mini Cooper with someone else's money.    

    shelbyturboz says:

    04:12 PM, 07/12/2010

    hey guys its funny how the new cars are being comparied to the old cars they replace and the old cars keep coming out ahead. How is this possible with all the new tec thats been invented in the last 20 to 30 years. I'll tell you why because gps, i pod, sync,push button start, bluetooth, etc, etc dont make a car fun to drive.They just make a boring car seem interesting enough to buy.The crx is a great example of simplicity.

    rod_stewart says:

    04:27 PM, 07/07/2010

    Oh and Hahahaaha

    "Track Test Results
    0-60 mph, mfr. claim (sec.) 8.5
    1/4-mile, mfr. claim (sec. @ mph) 16.7 @ 115"

    Hot damn that's a great trap speed for a 17-second car!!! LOL maybe the CRX did have crazy vtec and it just didn't kick in till you'd been driving for 13 seconds (the last 3.7 seconds would be awesome, vtec just KICKED IN YO!)

    rod_stewart says:

    04:18 PM, 07/07/2010

    From the photo caption: "The CRX Si's five-speed has great shift action, Honda's best ever"

    Now THAT is a BOLD statement. Ever driven an Integra? NSX? Prelude? Hell even the older Accords had great shifters. And how about the S2000 for cryin out loud! I have a hard time believing that this CRX is that good, I sure don't remember it being that good back in the day. I think old hondas just had amazingly good shifters, so every time you get into one today and compare it to new Hondas (which mostly suck) yeah of coruse it's going to seem like the best shifter ever.

    mrgold78 says:

    10:28 AM, 07/07/2010

    Why Honda are you trying so hard to convince us that this CR-Z is better than your own 23+ year old CR-X? Like your article says above, in the March 1985 Motor Trend issue, the original CR-X was good because compared to it's natural rivals it was "Faster than the Mitsubishi Mirage Turbo, Pontiac Fiero V6 and Toyota MR2" of it's time. Now let's get real for a minute here since it is 2010. What are the natural rivals to the CR-Z today if Honda dares to claim it is a sporty hatch back? Volkswagen GTI, Mini Cooper S and Mazdaspeed 3 are just three that comes to mind out of many and the CR-Z will lose badly to any of these. Heck the CR-Z even loses out to the base models of these three cars too (Volkswagen Golf, Mini Cooper and Mazda 3). How sad is that!

    Message to Honda: If you are going to make a claim to sporty performance then at least make your cars comparable to your competition. We are NOT impressed with your 122 combined hp Insight engine, semi-independent torsion beam rear suspension, P195/55R16 all-season low-rolling resistance tires or your quarter-mile in 17.1 seconds at 82.9 mph! We are not that stupid!

    bach1750 says:

    08:49 AM, 07/07/2010

    Hi 1987 Honda CRX Si - it's been awhile. You still look great and I still lust for you.

    sugarlandtx says:

    08:47 AM, 07/07/2010

    Another who cares story for losers.  Snore snore

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    Specs & Performance

    Vehicle
    Year Make Model2011 Honda CR-Z EX 2dr Hatchback With Navigation (1.5L 4cyl gas/electric hybrid 6M)
    Vehicle TypeFWD two-door, two-passenger hatchback
    Base MSRP$23,310
    Options on test vehicleNone
    As-tested MSRP$23,310
    Assembly locationSuzuka, Japan
    Drivetrain
    ConfigurationTransverse, front-engine combined with electric motor(s), front-wheel drive
    Engine typeNaturally aspirated, port-injected gasoline inline-4 with auto-stop/start
    Displacement (cc/cu-in)1,497cc (91 cu-in)
    Block/head materialAluminum/aluminum
    ValvetrainSOHC, four valves per cylinder, variable intake-valve timing
    Compression ratio (x:1)10.4
    Redline, indicated (rpm)6,500
    Fuel typeRegular unleaded
    Hybrid typeParallel
    Combined horsepower (hp @ rpm)122 @ 6,000 (includes electric motor assist of 13 hp @ 1,500 rpm)
    Combined torque (lb-ft @ rpm)128 @ 1,000 (includes electric motor assist of 58 lb-ft @ 1,000 rpm)
    Transmission typeSix-speed manual with console shifter
    Transmission ratios (x:1)I=3.143; II=1.870; III=1.303; IV=1.054; V=0.854; VI=0.639; Reverse=3.307
    Final-drive ratio (x:1)4.11
    Chassis
    Suspension, frontIndependent MacPherson struts, coil springs, stabilizer bar
    Suspension, rearSemi-independent twist-beam axle, coil springs, stabilizer bar
    Steering typeElectric speed-proportional power steering
    Steering ratio (x:1)12.8
    Turning circle (ft.)35.4
    Tire make and modelDunlop SP Sport 7000 M&S
    Tire typeAll-season, low-rolling resistance (30 psi cold front; 30 psi cold rear)
    Tire sizeP195/55R16 86V
    Wheel size16-by-6 inches
    Wheel materialCast aluminum
    Brakes, front10.3-inch ventilated steel discs with single-piston sliding calipers
    Brakes, rear10.2-inch solid steel discs with single-piston sliding calipers
    Fuel Consumption
    EPA fuel economy (mpg)31 city/37 highway/34 combined
    Edmunds observed (mpg)30.2
    Fuel tank capacity (U.S. gal.)10.6
    Driving range (mi.)392
    Dimensions & Capacities
    Curb weight, mfr. claim (lbs.)2,654
    Curb weight, as tested (lbs.)2,635
    Weight distribution, as tested, f/r (%)59.1/40.9
    Length (in.)160.6
    Width (in.)68.5
    Height (in.)54.9
    Wheelbase (in.)95.9
    Track, front (in.)59.6
    Track, rear (in.)59.1
    Legroom, front (in.)42.7
    Headroom, front (in.)36.9
    Shoulder room, front (in.)53.8
    Seating capacity2
    Max cargo volume behind 1st row (cu-ft)25.1
    GVWR (lbs.)3,131
    Tow capacity, mfr. claim (lbs.)Not Published
    CollapseSpecs and Performance Expand Collapse

    Specs & Performance

    Vehicle
    Year Make Model1987 Honda Civic CRX Si (1.5L 4cyl 5M)
    Vehicle TypeFWD, two-door, two-passenger coupe
    Estimated MSRP$8,475
    Assembly locationSuzuka, Japan
    Drivetrain
    ConfigurationTransverse, front-engine, front-wheel drive
    Engine typeNaturally aspirated port-injected gasoline inline-4
    Displacement (cc/cu-in)1,488cc/91 cu-in
    Block/head materialAluminum/aluminum
    ValvetrainSOHC, three valves per cylinder
    Compression ratio (x:1)8.7
    Horsepower (hp @ rpm)91 @ 5,500
    Torque (lb-ft @ rpm)93 @ 4,500 rpm
    Transmission typeFive-speed manual with console shifter
    Transmission ratios (x:1)I=2.92; II=1.76; III=1.19; IV=087; V=0.71; Reverse=3.15
    Final-drive ratio (x:1)4.40
    Chassis
    Suspension, frontIndependent MacPherson struts, torsion bars, dampers, stabilizer bar
    Suspension, rearSemi-independent trailing beam-axle, coil springs, dampers, trailing links, panhard rod, stabilizer bar
    Steering typeRack-and-pinion steering
    Turning circle (ft.)29.5
    Tire typeSummer
    Tire size185/60R14
    Wheel size14-by-5 inches
    Wheel materialStamped steel
    Brakes, front7.5-inch ventilated steel discs with single-piston sliding calipers
    Brakes, rear7.1-inch drums
    Track Test Results
    0-60 mph, mfr. claim (sec.)8.5
    1/4-mile, mfr. claim (sec. @ mph)16.2 @ 84.5
    Fuel Consumption
    Fuel economy, mfr. est. (mpg)26 city/30 highway
    Dimensions & Capacities
    Curb weight, mfr. claim (lbs.)1,953
    Length (in.)144.7
    Width (in.)63.9
    Height (in.)50.8
    Wheelbase (in.)86.8
    Track, front (in.)55.1
    Track, rear (in.)55.7
    CollapseSpecs and Performance Expand Collapse

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