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Comparison Test: 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe vs. 2011 BMW M3 Coupe

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Comparison

Comparison Test: 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe vs. 2011 BMW M3 Coupe

Splitting Heirs: As Close as It Comes to a Tie

    61 Ratings

    Nobody likes a tie.

    Well, that's not entirely true. Soccer fans seem unbothered by the idea of two mighty opponents meeting on the field of battle and leaving as if they'd never played, except deflated. We firmly believe that if two contestants enter a ring, one should emerge the victor and the other should suffer the agony of defeat and all that.

    So imagine our consternation when our recent dream assignment — pitting the supercharged V8-powered 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe against the high-revving V8-powered 2011 M3 Coupe with the new Competition package — turned into a dilemma. After the tire smoke cleared, we reviewed the point totals for each coupe and found — oh dear! — a near dead heat.

    These two high-performance coupes, so different in their driving dynamics, styling, power delivery and well, just about everything, nonetheless ended two weeks of evaluation with the CTS-V leading its more established supercoupe opponent by a scant 1.3 points.

    There was a time at Inside Line when a two-point difference was declared a tie. More recently we narrowed that to a one-point margin. So the 556-horsepower Cadillac wins, technically. It had some help, though. We'll explain later.

    Comparison Shopping
    Were it simply down to a numbers race between the M3 coupe and the CTS-V Coupe, this would have been the shortest, easiest comparison test ever staged.

    We already posted historical-M3 versus new-CTS-V numbers here and readers had their say. But there's more than a 12-second quarter-mile to consider when evaluating $70,000 high-performance coupes.

    The curvaceous carbon-topped 2011 BMW M3 Coupe's price begins at $60,575 and our tester totaled $67,025 thanks to the addition of the Competition and Technology packages and a few stand-alone extras. Thankfully, the six-speed manual transmission comes standard.

    In contrast, the angular 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe starts at $64,290 and our example came in at $69,285. The big-ticket extras? A set of Recaro seats for $3,400. A six-speed manual was part of the package, too.

    Yes, we know that the Cadillac is larger and considerably more powerful than the M3, but if $2,000-$4,000 matters after you've ponied up nearly $70K, then the BMW gets the slight nod.

    Advantage: BMW

    Horses, Torques and a Boulder
    Remember when we said the Cadillac was bigger than the M3? Yeah well, it outweighs the BMW by more than a quarter of a ton (650 pounds). Still, there's just no getting around the 142-hp deficit the M3 concedes to the CTS-V. Until the 2012 BMW M5 arrives, the CTS-V's 556 hp puts it in a league of its own. We learned this the last time a CTS-V sedan sent a BMW M5 and Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG packing.

    Perhaps more dramatic is the variance in torque production. The supercharged pushrod 6.2-liter V8 in the CTS-V produces 551 pound-feet of twisting force, or nearly double the 295 lb-ft maximum of the naturally aspirated, high-revving 4.0-liter V8 in the M3. The M3's motor is spectacular, but compared to the CTS-V engine's tidal wave of torque the M3 mill feels like an ankle-slapper. It's a difference you literally feel in the seat of your pants.

    The Cadillac was made to do smoky burnouts.

    At the drag strip the M3 gets the hole-shot on the CTS-V. The M3 is simply easier to launch because of its more predictable clutch bite and more linear power delivery. But once the CTS-V's vast power is transmitted to the whimpering pavement, the outcome is as inevitable as shoving a boulder off a ledge. Thump. (See acceleration graph in the photo gallery.)

    Both of the manual gearboxes proved excellent. Both glide easily through somewhat long gates. The Cadillac's clutch uptake is a bit smoother and easier with all that torque pulsing through its spinning bits. But the BMW's lightning-quick throttle response (especially in M mode) made it far easier to knock off near-flawless matched-rev downshifts.

    The Numbers
    The M3's best run produced a 0-60-mph time of 4.6 seconds (4.4 seconds with 1 foot of rollout) and a quarter-mile in 12.8 seconds at 111.2 mph. These results are within a tenth of a second and 1 mph of our best M3 coupe test.

    The CTS-V, however, on the way to a gob-smacking 12.2-second 117.5-mph quarter-mile, ran to 60 mph in just 4.2 seconds (or 3.9 seconds with 1 foot of rollout).

    This coupe's straight-line performance is a couple tenths and a couple mph quicker and faster than any of the several CTS-V sedans we've driven, including a six-speed manual we tested that was 92 pounds heavier.

    No doubt about it: This Caddy is a force-fed rocket, and it feels fast in any gear at any rpm. It's hard to get our heads around a car wearing the wreath and crest on its grille going faster than a Chevy Corvette Grand Sport did just a couple months ago.

    Advantage: Cadillac

    Four Pistons as Good as 20?
    We suppose, given their differing approaches to the supercoupe segment, it shouldn't be a surprise that the two vehicles' braking hardware reveal a huge difference in engineering philosophy. And again, these divergent approaches result in nearly equally impressive performances. Where the CTS-V features Brembo-sourced six-pot front and four-piston rear fixed calipers gripping one-piece ventilated discs, the BMW uses single-piston front and rear sliding calipers squeezing two-piece ventilated/cross-drilled rotors.

    The CTS-V came to a halt from 60 mph in 104 feet and the M3 in 107 feet — both exceptionally short and both fade-free. Both cars' brake pedals exhibited a sporty and appropriately steep jump-in, but we found the M3's to offer more tactile feedback and it was therefore easier to modulate with almost as much precision as a Porsche 911, the benchmark for brake feel.

    Advantage: Cadillac? BMW?

    But where every previous M3 we've tested provided even shorter stops than this example on its fourth or fifth stop, this one could do no better than it did on the first stop. And we're blaming the tires. Read on.

    The Worthwhile Competition Package (With One Modification)
    Go ahead and tick the "ZCP" Competition Package box if you're considering a 2011 BMW M3 this year. The new $2,500 package offers some truly useful upgrades, but there's one caveat.

    The ZCP package lowers the car by a noticeable 10mm and comes with some exceptionally handsome 19-inch forged aluminum wheels with deeper offset than stock hoops. Plus, BMW's electronic damper control (EDC) is reprogrammed so what was the firmest fixed-valve setting in "Sport" is now a variable-valve setting that offers a wider range of chassis control in a larger variety of road conditions. The "Comfort" and "Normal" settings remain unchanged from non-ZCP M3s.

    During the slalom runs, our test driver reported being curious about this M3's newfound compliance and improved yaw response in Sport. That damper selection (indicated by two lights adjacent to the button) has historically proved too firm and nervous for our 600-foot slalom test. So the M3 Competition package car feels better through the slalom and is less sensitive to bumps. But this car's Continental ContiSport Contact 3 tires couldn't cash the check written by the improved EDC tuning.

    The best results we could muster were 0.90g on the skid pad and a 67.7-mph pass in the slalom. Previous M3 coupe slalom speeds have been as high as 73.3-mph and skid pad orbits have been recorded as high as 0.95g — that's a big difference we attribute to tires.

    Every preceding E9X-generation M3 we've tested has been delivered with Michelin Pilot Sport PS2 tires — and each one (with the exception of a convertible) outperformed this loaner in our handling tests.

    We're told the M division has blessed both brands of identically sized and rated tires, and that the decision to fit Michelins or Contis depends on "just-in-time" delivery to the factory. Insist on the Michelin PS2s if you're buying.

    Agility Versus Feel
    Where the M3 felt nervous, the CTS-V felt a little dull — not as in boring, but as in less sharp than it was on the first day we received it. Because this was the second full test this car endured while in our possession, there's little doubt the slightly reduced grip (from 0.90g to 0.89g) and slower slalom speed (from 69.3 mph to 68.2 mph) were the result of several heat cycles we put on its tires — Michelin Pilot Sport PS2s, by the way.

    Despite the M3's poor tire choice and the disappointing instrumented-test results they produced, our experience tells us there's much more in this car than we measured on this day. The Cadillac may have made the numbers, but we'd still have to give the handling and dynamic feel award to the hobbled BMW. Telepathic steering response and a near-perfect driving position count for more in our books than a deficit of 0.5-mph in the slalom.

    Advantage: BMW. However...

    ...the 4,200-pound Cadillac amazed us with how well its continually self-adjusting magnetorheological dampers can both firmly suspend the CTS-V for track tests and isolate occupants from nasty pavement out in the real world. Even with its rejiggered EDC, the short-wheelbase M3 couldn't match the Cadillac's all-around capabilities.

    Advantage: Cadillac

    Size Matters
    Both of these two-doors share the same wheelbase measurements of their four-door counterparts, and both jettison the center position of the rear seat in the conversion to coupes. Further, legroom and headroom in both cars' driver seats remain essentially the same as their sedan versions, with the exception of the CTS-V Coupe's front headroom dropping by about an inch from the sedan. Because of our experience with their sedan counterparts, we expected the interior measurements to favor the Cadillac over the BMW in coupe form.

    However, in the transformation from sedan to coupe, the CTS-V lost more volume and inches than the M3. Of particular note, the CTS-V's rear headroom dropped by a head-knocking 2.6 inches where the M3 only lost 0.7 inch, retaining habitable dimensions.

    Rear passenger shoulder room shrank by 6.5 inches in the CTS-V and 5.3 inches in the M3, still favoring the M3 by an inch. Finally, besides its narrower orifice and luggage-crushing gooseneck hinges specific to the coupe, trunk volume in the CTS-V was reduced by 3 cubic feet. The M3's trunk retained cargo-friendly scissor hinges and lost just 1 cube, giving it the clear advantage.

    Advantage: BMW

    That both of these high-performance cars are available in far more accommodating and practical sedan form — with essentially no loss of performance — would make the choice of a coupe purely a styling preference. That's where the CTS-V Coupe detours farther from its sedan brother than the M3 does.

    Style Matters
    Aside from the way-cool standard carbon-fiber roof panel, you'd barely be able to see the difference in a quick glance between M3 coupe and sedan. They evidence the same economical use of organically shaped metal and the same well-vented fasciae. The coupe offers only a slightly sportier profile.

    Put a CTS-V Coupe and sedan side by side and even a novice would notice that only the front fenders, grille and headlamps are the same. The absence of door handles is the give-away in profile, but especially from the rear, the CTS-V Coupe is really trying very hard (too hard?) to make a bold statement.

    The CTS-V Coupe interior shares much with its sedan counterpart. That means the same inboard knee-thrashing occurs in the CTS-V's front seat, but it also means the same rich, high-quality interior materials are used, as are the innovative pop-up infotainment screen and hard-drive-based navigation and music storage — which we like very much.

    In contrast, the M3's interior, like most BMWs, looks pretty austere. We're over the moon that the latest version of iDrive has found its way to the M3, and the optional hard-drive-based navigation, too. Sure the materials quality is expectedly high, but it isn't much to look at.

    Advantage: Let your personal aesthetic sensibilities be your guide.

    Sillier Than a Shoot-Out?
    Because all of this thoughtful consideration and careful measuring, to say nothing of all the gallons of gas burned, brought us to an effective stalemate between these two, we've decided to do something utterly ridiculous.

    Allow us to introduce you to our new tie-breaking procedure, performed in accordance with the rules of the High-Output Oversteer Naturalization (HOON) committee: the drift competition.

    We did our first exploratory pass in the ultra-precise M3 assuming that its shorter wheelbase, quick, informative steering (in M mode) and mile-high redline would make it a natural. But we had to zing the BMW motor up near redline (8,400 rpm) to kick the tail out. Once the drift started, there wasn't enough headroom left to stay out of the rev limiter. And there wasn't enough torque below to maintain wheelspin. We also found the combo of short wheelbase and quick steering to be almost too precise for such a gratuitous show of smoky acrobatics. It's almost as if BMW didn't design the Continental sophisticate for such gross displays of ridiculousness.

    Yes, the M3 can drift, repeatedly, precisely and with a pretty glorious V8 howl, but it also requires vigilance and a well-rehearsed plan.

    Then the CTS-V came in with a stunning display of power and vulgarity. The Caddy's got exactly the right combo of a semi-long wheelbase, a shipping container's worth of torque and lightly weighted steering. The CTS-V put down uninterrupted black stripes not just through our test corner but through the following straight and into the next corner. God Bless America, huh?

    It was only after this dramatic and decidedly lopsided display that we felt compelled to add the HOON score in honor of the CTS-V Coupe. We even drew a new box for the previously absent category. The CTS-V got a perfect 10.

    Advantage: Cadillac

    A Win's a Win
    OK, so we let a drifting contest settle a score that was too close to call. You got a better idea? Track numbers only tell part of the story. Price, features, fuel economy, evaluations and editors' picks fill in the blanks, but that ended in an implicit stalemate.

    In all seriousness, we think this is a pretty polarized segment. You're likely either a fan of one or the other of these cars. Do we honestly believe you'll choose the CTS-V Coupe over the M3 because of its superior driftability? No, we do not.

    But in this comparison test, the Cadillac CTS-V Coupe is the winner. It represents a unique combination of Corvette-beating acceleration, a paranormal ability to smooth out rough roads and tear up test roads, head-turning looks, loads of standard features and a price that is at the very least, fair for the segment. And it can do positively vulgar things, too, if that's what you want.

    Rock on, Cadillac. You won this round fair and square; not by a landslide, but by a powerslide.

    The manufacturers provided Edmunds these vehicles for the purposes of evaluation.

    Comparison

    Top 8 Features

    As with every Inside Line comparison test, we make a comparative tally of equipment and feature offerings in an effort to justify vehicle pricing discrepancies. For this reason, we apply the same weight (15 percent in this case) toward the final score based on the availability of standard and optional (absent and/or present) equipment.

    Also, we do not include items shared as standard equipment, as their presence would not affect the score. For instance, both the 2011 BMW M3 Coupe and 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe are equipped with limited-slip differentials, dual-zone auto climate control and active xenon headlamps. Both cars also are offered with automatic transmissions (a seven-speed dual-clutch automated manual in the M3 and a traditional six-speed automatic in the CTS-V), a moonroof (though doing so on the M3 would replace the desirable carbon-fiber roof with a steel roof) and highly polished aluminum wheels.

    Features
      2011 BMW M3 Coupe 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe
    Automatic hill-hold brakes S N/A
    Bluetooth phone connection O* S
    Heated front seats O S
    Intelligent key (active vehicle locking/feedback) O N/A
    Intelligent key (with passive entry/ignition) O S
    Multimode dampers O S
    Navigation system with real-time traffic O S
    Rearview camera N/A S


    Key:
    S: Standard
    O: Optional and present
    O*: Optional but absent
    N/A: Not Available

    Automatic hill-hold brakes: Takes the stress out of starting (in either forward or reverse gear) on a steep incline without rolling downhill. Standard on the M3; not available on the CTS-V.

    Bluetooth phone connection: Though it is far from intuitive, requires the vehicle to be stopped, necessitates the use of voice recognition with specific commands and lasts six steps (the first time), Bluetooth phone pairing is standard on the CTS-V Coupe. Bluetooth is optional on the M3, though not on our test car.

    Heated front seats: Standard heated/ventilated seats on the CTS-V; optional heated seats on the M3.

    Intelligent key (active vehicle locking/feedback): BMW's intelligent key also offers the peace of mind of an active (not passive) door-locking feature. When leaving the vehicle, lock the car simply by touching the BMW's door handle.

    The Cadillac offers no such affirmative locking, but instead relies on either fishing out the remote to press the lock button or using the auto-door lock program and simply walking away from the car without confirming that it's being locked.

    Intelligent key (with passive entry/ignition): BMW's "Comfort Access" intelligent key was once a stand-alone option, but it is now part of the Technology package. With the key in your pocket/handbag, you can open the locked doors/trunk and start the car.

    Cadillac's "Keyless Access" offers the same functionality, but it is standard equipment on the CTS-V Coupe.

    Multimode dampers: The optional electronic damper control (EDC) on the 2011 BMW M3 is available as a $1,000 stand-alone option or within either the Competition or Technology packages. These multivalve dampers offer three driver-selectable settings.

    The 2011 Cadillac CTS-V's Magnetic Ride Control offers only two driver-selectable settings; however, the shock absorbers contain a special oil mixture that rapidly changes its viscosity to suit a variety of road conditions or a desired ride comfort and thus are almost infinitely self-adjusting.

    Navigation system with real-time traffic: Standard hard-drive-based navigation system with traffic is standard on the CTS-V Coupe and optional on the M3.

    Rearview camera: Displayed on the same pop-up screen as the navigation system (and a multitude of other things), the CTS-V's back-up camera is standard equipment.

    Currently , the M3 offers optional rear-facing proximity sensors only.

    Comparison

    Data and Charts

    Dimensions
    Engine & Transmission Specifications
    Warranty Information
    Performance Information


    Dimensions
    Exterior Dimensions & Capacities
      2011 BMW M3 Coupe 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe
    Length, in. 181.8 188.5
    Width, in. 71.0 74.1
    Height, in. 55.8 55.9
    Wheelbase, in. 108.7 113.4
    As Tested Curb Weight, lb. 3,556 4,200
    Turning Circle, ft. 38.4 37.9


    Interior Dimensions
      2011 BMW M3 Coupe 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe
    Front headroom, in. 38.4 36.9
    Rear headroom, in. 36.8 34.6
    Front shoulder room, in. 55.3 56.0
    Rear shoulder room, in. 51.9 50.9
    Front legroom, in. 41.8 42.4
    Rear legroom, in. 33.7 35.0
    Cargo volume, cu-ft. 11.0 10.5
    Total passenger volume, cu-ft. 88.5 86.6


    Engine & Transmission Specifications
    Engine & Transmission
      2011 BMW M3 Coupe 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe
    Displacement
    (cc / cu-in):
    3999 (244) 6162 (376)
    Engine Type Naturally aspirated V8 Supercharged V8
    Horsepower (SAE) @ rpm 414 @ 8,300 556 @ 6,100
    Max. Torque, lb-ft @ rpm 295 @ 3,900 551 @ 3,800
    Maximum engine speed, rpm 8,400 6,200
    Compression ratio 12.0:1 9.1:1
    Transmission Six-speed manual with LSD Six-speed manual with LSD
    EPA Fuel Economy City, mpg 14.0 14.0
    EPA Fuel Economy Hwy, mpg 20.0 19.0
    Observed Fuel Economy combined, mpg 15.7 (406 mi.) 14.4 (818 mi.)


    Warranty
    Warranty Information
      2011 BMW M3 Coupe 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe
    Basic Warranty 4 years/50,000 miles 4 years/50,000 miles
    Powertrain 4 years/50,000 miles 5 years/100,000 miles
    Roadside Assistance 4 years/unlimited miles 5 years/100,000 miles
    Free scheduled maintenance 4 years/50,000 miles 4 years/50,000 miles
    Corrosion Protection 12 years/unlimited miles 6 years/100,000 miles


    Performance
    Performance Information
      2011 BMW M3 Coupe 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe
    0-60 mph acceleration, sec. 4.6 4.2
    Quarter-mile acceleration, sec. 12.8 12.2
    Quarter-mile speed, mph 111.2 117.5
    60-0-mph braking, feet 107 104
    Lateral Acceleration, g 0.90 0.89
    600-ft slalom, mph 67.7 68.2

    Comparison

    Final Rankings and Scoring Explanation

    Final Rankings
      Item Weight 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe 2011 BMW M3 Coupe
    Personal Rating 2.5% 50.0 100.0
    Recommended Rating 2.5% 50.0 100.0
    Evaluation Score 25% 78.7 82.3
    Feature Content 15% 75.0 58.3
    Performance 25% 99.7 87.1
    Fuel Consumption 15% 97.2 100.0
    Price 15% 96.6 100.0
           
    Total Score 100.0% 87.4 86.1
    Final Ranking   1 2


    Personal Rating (2.5%): Purely subjective. After the test, each participating editor was asked to rank the two sport coupes in order of preference based on which he or she would buy if money were no object.

    Recommended Rating (2.5%): After the test, each participating editor was asked to rank the vehicles in order of preference based on which he or she thought would be best for the average consumer shopping in this segment, including that car-savvy relative or family friend who has our number on speed dial. (We get this all the time.)

    28-Point Evaluation (25%): Each participating editor ranked both cars based on a comprehensive 28-point evaluation. The point of this exhaustive exercise is to examine in detail the qualities and liabilities of both cars in a universal sense. The evaluation covered everything from exterior design to transmission performance to button wobble/stability. Things like ride comfort and rear-seat comfort/access as well as audio system layout are included in this overall score. Calculated on a point system, the scores listed are averages based on all test participants' evaluations of the cars' qualities/mistakes.

    Feature Content (15%): For this category, the editors picked eight features they thought would be most demonstrative of where the true cost is (beyond a badge or inherent performance capabilities). We did not include features that were potentially or actually shared — such as limited-slip differentials, automatic transmissions or articulating xenon headlamps, for example — as doing so would not affect a relative difference in score. For each vehicle, the score was based on the number of features it had as standard equipment (earning three points), optional and present on our test vehicle (two points), optional but not included (one point) or not available (zero points) on our test vehicles.

    Performance Testing (25%): For this particular comparison, we've weighted these cars' track performances greater than one for, say minivans. Flat-out acceleration, braking and handling tests were performed in a controlled environment by the same driver on the same day.

    Fuel Consumption (15%): Based on current or expected results of the EPA's "Combined" fuel economy tests, the vehicle with the better fuel economy scores 100, and the less efficient car earns a score based on a simple percentage of the more efficient one.

    Price (15%): The numbers listed were the result of a simple percentage calculation based on the less expensive vehicle in the comparison test. Using the "as tested" prices of the actual evaluation vehicles, the less expensive car received a score of 100, with the remaining car receiving a lesser score based on how much each one costs. We purposely assign the exact same weight to this category as we do for the Feature comparison in an attempt to justify a car's value or lack thereof.

    Sort By:

    bobtheb says:

    08:00 PM, 10/18/2011

    M3 is going to be more expensive than the CTS-V.  M3 base of is the sedan with zero options and doesn't include gas guzzler tax.  Once you add a few options (like paint, auto transmission, sunroof, power seats, etc..) the M3 is over 72K.

    Also, I wouldn't want to own an M3 out of warranty.  The cost to repair can be astronomical.

    rubinio says:

    09:42 AM, 09/29/2011

    As of today (09/29/2011)

    the base M3 sedan: MSRP $55,900
    the base CTS-V     : MSRP $63,660

    $7,760: that's an easy choice for me

    naanabozho says:

    09:52 AM, 04/29/2011

    I do not trust GM.  Don't get me wrong, I've had numerous examples of the company's product over the years, including Oldsmobiles, Pontiacs, Chevvys, and Cadillacs, and driven many that weren't mine: but their company attitude (cheap designed as glitz) always makes me feel like I'm driving a car that's pretending to be more than it is.

    That said, BMW is the home of sophisticated engineering, and nothing I've ever seen under any hood can match the E85 V10 F1-inspired powerplant in the last M5/M6, of which the M3's plant is but an 8-squirrel version.  

    So: is the Caddy a few tenths better here & there?  Absolutely.  Does it HP & torque-kick the M3 in the keister?  Absolutely.  But considering the Cad's got 150 more HP & 250 more ft.-lbs, it damn well should.  And it's surprising it doesn't do it more thoroughly.

    And then there's this: if my choices are a Caddy for $69K or a BMW for $67K, I'll take the BMW 17 out of 16 times.  Crude American cheap = good engineering vs. Refined German good = good engineering is the be-all.  $70K for a US car that's not a Corvette or a Viper = Not-a-chance.

    sirraf1 says:

    08:09 AM, 11/09/2010

    I've had the opportunity to travel extensively, and have owned or driven a number of interesting cars. The plan for my retirement car is the Cadillac CTS-V coupe unless GM does what they have numerous times in the past and screw it up. To think that the CTS-V ever came about during GM's trouble years is amazing. Is the car perfect, no; but name one that is. The CTS-V is a blunt instrument tuned to the driving characteristics in the US. Over here torque rules. The ridiculous speed limits we have are actually too fast for most of the coffee-drinking, telephoning, left-lane idiots, we drive with today. As I tell friends, a car that has great brakes is fine, but the guy behind you needs them also, and his full attention on the task at hand. I've done the gymkana thing, but work too hard to tear up my cars  and tires doing track days. When my fangs start to grow I go to an indoor kart track near my home. I guess I've said all that to say this; for someone who wants a high speed highway missile, but still retain the ability to essentially stomp anything into the ground you might come up against on a daily basis, the CTS-V coupe or sedan is hard to beat.    

    pathos says:

    08:50 AM, 09/30/2010

    1speedbike says:

    09:11 PM, 08/29/2010

    As I have discussed with many folks, BMW will forever be a preset winner in any automotive publication, be it online or a magazine. I just dont get it, if BMW made a horrible car, it would still be number 1 over something substantially better.

    --------------------------------

    You should read a car mag once in a while. Especially comparo's with the Z4 and X3. And maybe recent 3 and 5 series ones too.

    It's true old habits die hard, like your perception of a car brand.

    pathos says:

    08:43 AM, 09/30/2010

    chavis10 says:

    08:01 AM, 09/03/2010

    "On top of that, the V destroys everything around the 'Ring- with an automatic transmission that was not manually shifted.  Please, to all of you who keeping saying the V is too heavy, explain why the almighty BMWs cannot complete a lap faster than the overweight V?"

    ----------------------------------

    If you think 6 seconds on an 8 minute track is destroying something, you go right on ahead tiger.

    Also, if you want to keep it pretty simple, the m3 is slower because it has a 142 hp and 256 torque deficit. Of course, we don't know how exactly many seconds that would buy. There would be mild weight gain, but that that's not very meaningful to you.  

    chavis10 says:

    08:01 AM, 09/03/2010

    On top of that, the V destroys everything around the 'Ring- with an automatic transmission that was not manually shifted.  Please, to all of you who keeping saying the V is too heavy, explain why the almighty BMWs cannot complete a lap faster than the overweight V?  

    Again, after driving this thing, I don't see how anyone could say it's overweight.  It's a big car, with a big wheelbase and drives like a smaller more nimble package.  If anyone can fully exploit the V on a public road (or even a track) then I will shut up.  I doubt anyone here can.  It's amazing how world renowned race car drivers can take the way too heavy V to the limit on the world's most challenging circuit and not complain but your average Joes on this forum who drive on regular roads are someone more demanding.  Heck, some dedicated Astons and Ferrari approach 4000 lbs and they are supposedly sports cars so, give me a break here.  Cadillac has built a car the size of a E class for M3 money, period.  Heck, if you option up an M3 or C63, you can almost touch $80k.  

    John Heinricy himself even said that the brakes, suspension and tires weren't even taxed after that run- heard it straight from his mouth a couple of weeks ago.  This on a car that is too heavy???  Give it a rest folks.  

    chavis10 says:

    07:52 AM, 09/03/2010

    "It's nice to get another perspective though. The CTS is a great car, and the CTS-V is a beast. I only fear that it embodies Detroit's stereotypical strategy of bigger = better. Car's too heavy? Make the engine bigger. Problem solved? Not quite..."

    I don't get your logic- the V is dimensionally similar to the E63 and weighs about the same.  They both have "bigger" engines of equal displacement.  So, why then is the V considered to be "too heavy?"

    Please explain.  

    1speedbike says:

    09:11 PM, 08/29/2010

    Interesting. Car Magazine (UK) just tested the M3 vs the CTS-V vs the RS4, and Motor Trend tested the M3 vs the CTS-V vs the RS5. The general consensus was the CTS-V was a beast, but it was way too heavy, and while the tremendous horsepower made up for this in some aspects, it can't make up for it in all respects.

    It's nice to get another perspective though. The CTS is a great car, and the CTS-V is a beast. I only fear that it embodies Detroit's stereotypical strategy of bigger = better. Car's too heavy? Make the engine bigger. Problem solved? Not quite...

    Still... would anyone have thought of this comparison ever being made in the 90's? Early 2000's? Even a couple years ago? No way. Good job GM.

    derrell says:

    07:39 PM, 08/29/2010

    As I have discussed with many folks, BMW will forever be a preset winner in any automotive publication, be it online or a magazine. I just dont get it, if BMW made a horrible car, it would still be number 1 over something substantially better. I would like to make a test and compare these two cars to folks who are normal people who like to drive and cover up every indication as to whom the manufacturer is and see which one they would prefer.I bet the CTS-V would be the winner. Its way too many BMW's on the road, be different and get something you wont see every five seconds and that will still look pretty good a few years from now

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    Speed Read

    1st Place: 2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe

    A combination of brute force and glamorous presentation, the CTS-V ekes out a narrow victory for Cadillac's performance division — and it drifts like a mutha.

    2nd Place: 2011 BMW M3 Coupe

    Still a benchmark in terms of precision, dynamic feedback and reserved styling, the M3 finds itself out-muscled and under-tired for this high-stakes contest.

    Tags

    Specs & Performance

    Vehicle
    Year Make Model2011 Cadillac CTS-V Coupe (6.2L 8cyl S/C 6M)
    Vehicle TypeRWD 2dr 4-passenger Coupe
    Base MSRP$64,290
    Options on test vehicleGLH Thunder Gray ChromaFlair ($995); W2E Recaro Performance Seats ($3,400 -- includes Recaro performance 14-way heated and ventilated front seats with pneumatic bolsters, deletes split-folding rear seat); 3AS Wood Trim Package ($600 -- includes genuine Midnight Sapele wood trim on instrument panel, center console and door panels).
    As-tested MSRP$69,285
    Assembly locationLansing, MI
    North American parts content (%)Being researched
    Drivetrain
    ConfigurationLongitudinal, front-engine, rear-wheel drive
    Engine typeSupercharged, port-injected gasoline V8
    Displacement (cc/cu-in)6,162cc (376cu-in)
    Block/head materialAluminum/aluminum
    ValvetrainPushrod, two valves per cylinder
    Compression ratio (x:1)9.1
    Redline, indicated (rpm)6,250
    Fuel cutoff/rev limiter (rpm)6,200
    Horsepower (hp @ rpm)556 @ 6,100
    Torque (lb-ft @ rpm)551 @ 3,800
    Fuel type87-octane acceptable + 91-octane for best performance
    Transmission typeSix-speed manual
    Transmission ratios (x:1)1st = 2.66; 2nd = 1.78; 3rd = 1.30; 4th = 1.00; 5th = 0.80; 6th = 0.63
    Final-drive ratio (x:1)3.73
    Differential(s)Mechanical limited-slip
    Chassis
    Suspension, frontIndependent double-wishbones, coil springs, driver-adjustable two-mode magnetorheological dampers, stabilizer bar
    Suspension, rearIndependent double-wishbone, coil springs, driver-adjustable two-mode magnetorheological dampers, stabilizer bar
    Steering typeHydraulic-assist, speed-proportional rack-and-pinion power steering
    Steering ratio (x:1)16.1
    Turning circle (ft.)37.9
    Tire make and modelMichelin Pilot PS2
    Tire typeAsymmetrical+Directional Performance Summer
    Tire size, front255/40R19 96Y
    Tire size, rear285/35R19 99Y
    Wheel size, front19-by-9 inches
    Wheel size, rear19-by-9.5 inches
    Wheel materialPainted, forged aluminum
    Brakes, front15.0-inch one-piece ventilated steel discs with 6-piston fixed calipers
    Brakes, rear14.7-inch one-piece ventilated steel discs with 4-piston fixed calipers
    Track Test Results
    Acceleration, 0-30 mph (sec.)1.9
    0-45 mph (sec.)2.9
    0-60 mph (sec.)4.2
    0-60 with 1 foot of rollout (sec.)3.9
    0-75 mph (sec.)5.8
    1/4-mile (sec. @ mph)12.2 @ 117.5
    Braking, 30-0 mph (ft.)27
    60-0 mph (ft.)104
    Slalom, 6 x 100 ft. (mph)68.2
    Slalom, 6 x 100 ft. (mph) ESC ON67.4
    Skid pad, 200-ft. diameter (lateral g)0.89
    Skid pad, 200-ft. diameter (lateral g) ESC ON0.89
    Sound level @ idle (dB)48.1
    @ Full throttle (dB)80.9
    @ 70 mph cruise (dB)72.1
    Engine speed @ 70 mph (rpm)2,100
    Test Driver Ratings & Comments
    Acceleration commentsWow! As usual, GM's supercharged 6.2-liter V8 amazes: No whine, no surge, no drama, just propulsion. Difficult to launch well, but still quite consistent with no apparent heat-soak. The Coupe scratches rubber on both the 1-2 and 2-3 shifts. No programmed launch control available -- seems an odd choice.
    Braking commentsAmazing power and fade resistance from firm pedal with shallow jump-in. No dive, no wander, just dead consistent.
    Handling ratingVery good
    Handling commentsSkid pad: On this retest for the comparison, front tires gave up well before rears and the car wasn't responding to lift-stab on the throttle. The tires' health is borderline at this point. Still the steering remains light, smooth and precise at this speed. Slalom: As it is with these previously tested tires, the car offers the same crisp turn-in, but not the same front-end bite/grip as before. I had to plan on some push prior to the car actually responding with a yaw change. Good in transition, excellent at soaking up dip/bump and wonderful though the final gate on the power with a "dab of oppo." Easy to control despite its size/mass.
    Testing Conditions
    Test date7/13/2010
    Test locationCalifornia Speedway
    Elevation (ft.)1,121
    Temperature (°F)63.06
    Relative humidity (%)77.94
    Barometric pressure (in. Hg)28.82
    Wind (mph, direction)3.75, head-crosswind
    Odometer (mi.)855
    Fuel used for test91-octane gasoline
    As-tested tire pressures, f/r (psi)32/32
    Fuel Consumption
    EPA fuel economy (mpg)14 city/19 highway/16 combined
    Edmunds observed (mpg)13 worst/16 best/14 average (818 miles)
    Fuel tank capacity (U.S. gal.)18.0
    Driving range (mi.)342
    Audio and Advanced Technology
    Stereo descriptionBose 5.1 Cabin Surround 300-watt 10-speaker AM/FM/XM, in-dash single-CD/DVD with MP3 playback with 40GB hard drive, USB audio connectivity
    iPod/digital media compatibilityiPod via USB jack
    Satellite radioStandard XM (3-month trial subscription)
    Hard-drive music storage capacity (Gb)Being researched
    Rear seat video and entertainmentNot available
    Bluetooth phone connectivityStandard
    Navigation systemStandard hard-drive with traffic (1 year service included)
    Telematics (OnStar, etc.)Standard (12-month trial subscription)
    Smart entry/StartStandard ignition, doors, trunk
    Parking aidsStandard parking sonar rear back-up camera
    Blind-spot detectionNot available
    Adaptive cruise controlNot available
    Lane-departure monitoringNot available
    Collision warning/avoidanceNot available
    Night VisionNot available
    Driver coaching displayStandard (instantaneous/average fuel consumption display)
    Dimensions & Capacities
    Curb weight, mfr. claim (lbs.)4,204
    Curb weight, as tested (lbs.)4,200
    Weight distribution, as tested, f/r (%)51/49
    Length (in.)188.5
    Width (in.)74.1
    Height (in.)55.9
    Wheelbase (in.)113.4
    Track, front (in.)61.8
    Track, rear (in.)62.9
    Legroom, front (in.)42.4
    Legroom, rear (in.)35.0
    Headroom, front (in.)36.9
    Headroom, rear (in.)34.6
    Shoulder room, front (in.)56.1
    Shoulder room, rear (in.)50.9
    Seating capacity4
    Trunk volume (cu-ft)10.5
    Warranty
    Bumper-to-bumper4 years/50,000 miles
    Powertrain5 years/100,000 miles
    Corrosion6 years/100,000 miles
    Roadside assistance5 years/100,000 miles
    Free scheduled maintenance4 years/50,000 miles
    CollapseSpecs and Performance Expand Collapse

    Specs & Performance

    Vehicle
    Year Make Model2011 BMW M3 Coupe (4.0L 8cyl 6M)
    Vehicle TypeRWD 2dr 4-passenger Coupe
    Base MSRP$60,575
    Options on test vehicleMelbourne Red Metallic ($550), ZTP Technology Package ($2,500 -- [when combined with ZCP] includes M Drive button on steering wheel, Comfort Access keyless entry/ignition/locking, hard-drive-based navigation system, real-time traffic information, voice command voice-activated functionality); ZCP Competition Package ($2,500 -- includes electronic damping control [EDC] with driver-selectable settings of either "Comfort," "Normal" or "Sport," Sport mapping for electronic damping control (EDC)/dynamic stability control [DSC], 19-by-9-inch front and 19-by-10-inch rear Y-Spoke [style 359M] alloy wheels with 245/35ZR19 93Y front and 265/35ZR19 98Y rear performance tires, 10mm lowered suspension); 494 Heated Front Seats ($500), 6FL iPod and USB Adapter ($400).
    As-tested MSRP$67,025
    Assembly locationRegensburg, Germany
    North American parts content (%)5%
    Drivetrain
    ConfigurationLongitudinal, front-engine, rear-wheel drive
    Engine typeNaturally aspirated, port-injected gasoline V8
    Displacement (cc/cu-in)3,999cc (244cu-in)
    Block/head materialAluminum/aluminum
    ValvetrainDOHC, four valves per cylinder, variable intake + exhaust-valve timing
    Compression ratio (x:1)12.0
    Redline, indicated (rpm)8,250
    Fuel cutoff/rev limiter (rpm)8,400
    Horsepower (hp @ rpm)414 @ 8,300
    Torque (lb-ft @ rpm)295 @ 3,900
    Fuel typePremium unleaded (required)
    Transmission typeSix-speed manual
    Transmission ratios (x:1)1st = 4.055, 2nd = 2.396, 3rd = 1.582, 4th = 1.192, 5th = 1.000, 6th = 0.872
    Final-drive ratio (x:1)3.85
    Differential(s)Electronic limited-slip
    Chassis
    Suspension, frontIndependent MacPherson struts, coil springs, driver-adjustable three-mode variable dampers, stabilizer bar
    Suspension, rearIndependent multilink, coil springs, driver-adjustable three-mode variable dampers, stabilizer bar
    Steering typeHydraulic-assist, speed-proportional, variable-ratio, rack-and-pinion power steering
    Steering ratio (x:1)12.5
    Turning circle (ft.)38.4
    Tire make and modelContinental ContiSport Contact 3
    Tire typeAsymmetrical Performance Summer
    Tire size, front245/35ZR19 93Y
    Tire size, rear265/35ZR19 98Y
    Wheel size, front19-by-9 inches
    Wheel size, rear19-by-10 inches
    Wheel materialForged aluminum
    Brakes, front14.2-inch two-piece ventilated cross-drilled steel discs with single-piston sliding calipers
    Brakes, rear13.8-inch two-piece ventilated cross-drilled steel discs with single-piston sliding calipers
    Track Test Results
    Acceleration, 0-30 mph (sec.)2.1
    0-45 mph (sec.)3.6
    0-60 mph (sec.)4.6
    0-60 with 1 foot of rollout (sec.)4.4
    0-75 mph (sec.)6.5
    1/4-mile (sec. @ mph)12.8 @ 111.2
    Braking, 30-0 mph (ft.)27
    60-0 mph (ft.)107
    Slalom, 6 x 100 ft. (mph)67.7
    Slalom, 6 x 100 ft. (mph) ESC ON65.9
    Skid pad, 200-ft. diameter (lateral g)0.90
    Skid pad, 200-ft. diameter (lateral g) ESC ON0.90
    Sound level @ idle (dB)51.2
    @ Full throttle (dB)84.2
    @ 70 mph cruise (dB)70.0
    Engine speed @ 70 mph (rpm)1,900
    Test Driver Ratings & Comments
    Acceleration commentsRequires a fairly high-rpm launch (3,000-3,500) to avoid bogging, but then it's easy to light the tires -- which aren't as predictable/tractable as the Michelin PS2 tires. These Contis have peaky grip/release and as they heated up, I had to lower my launch rpm. Love the 8,400-rpm rev limit and the sound the V8 makes. Got a scratch into both 2nd and 3rd on the best run.
    Braking commentsUnlike typical M3 braking performances, this one made its best stop first, and distances increased from there. Firm pedal, near-zero dive, arrow straight and negligible fade (2 feet from 1st to 5th stop).
    Handling ratingVery good
    Handling commentsSkid pad: Excellent grip, balance, and talkative steering with a chassis that responds properly to throttle manipulation. Lower ultimate number than previously observed, but the tires are different this time around -- not better. Slalom: This is not what I'd call a typical "I could do this all day long" slalom experience. The rear was always threatening to visit the front. Also, we usually prefer the "Normal" setting on EDC, but that was insufficient to keep the car responsive in the quick transitions, so we opted for "Sport" this time around to enhance steering response. Do yourself a favor and get the Michelin PS2s instead of these ContiSports.
    Testing Conditions
    Test date7/13/2010
    Test locationCalifornia Speedway
    Elevation (ft.)1,121
    Temperature (°F)64.9
    Relative humidity (%)70.2
    Barometric pressure (in. Hg)28.82
    Wind (mph, direction)3.2, headwind
    Odometer (mi.)4,065
    Fuel used for test91-octane gasoline
    As-tested tire pressures, f/r (psi)33/35
    Fuel Consumption
    EPA fuel economy (mpg)14 city/20 highway/16 combined
    Edmunds observed (mpg)15 worst/17 best/16 average (406 miles)
    Fuel tank capacity (U.S. gal.)16.6
    Driving range (mi.)332
    Audio and Advanced Technology
    Stereo descriptionAlpine 10-speaker AM/FM/XM, in-dash single-CD/MP3 playback with 80GB hard-drive-based navigation system with real-time traffic and voice-activated functionality, optional iPod/USB audio connectivity.
    iPod/digital media compatibilityOptional iPod via USB jack
    Satellite radioOptional XM
    Hard-drive music storage capacity (Gb)8
    Rear seat video and entertainmentNot available
    Bluetooth phone connectivityOptional
    Navigation systemOptional hard drive with traffic
    Telematics (OnStar, etc.)Optional (BMW Assist)
    Smart entry/StartOptional ignition, doors, trunk
    Parking aidsOptional parking sonar, rear
    Blind-spot detectionNot available
    Adaptive cruise controlNot available
    Lane-departure monitoringNot available
    Collision warning/avoidanceNot available
    Night VisionNot available
    Driver coaching displayStandard (instantaneous/average fuel consumption display)
    Dimensions & Capacities
    Curb weight, mfr. claim (lbs.)3,704
    Curb weight, as tested (lbs.)3,556
    Weight distribution, as tested, f/r (%)51/49
    Length (in.)181.8
    Width (in.)71.0
    Height (in.)55.8
    Wheelbase (in.)108.7
    Track, front (in.)60.5
    Track, rear (in.)60.5
    Legroom, front (in.)41.8
    Legroom, rear (in.)33.7
    Headroom, front (in.)38.4
    Headroom, rear (in.)36.8
    Shoulder room, front (in.)55.3
    Shoulder room, rear (in.)51.9
    Seating capacity4
    Trunk volume (cu-ft)11.0
    Warranty
    Bumper-to-bumper4 years/50,000 miles
    Powertrain4 years/50,000 miles
    Corrosion12 years/Unlimited miles
    Roadside assistance4 years/Unlimited miles
    Free scheduled maintenance4 years/50,000 miles
    CollapseSpecs and Performance Expand Collapse

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